Macbeth Journal #6
Post a response to one of the prompts below; you must provide at least two citations from the text to support your position. Title your work with your first and last name, include the bold-faced title below and your class period, and don’t forget to respond.
- No Man of Woman Born (4.1)-What is the significance of apparition number two?
- I Just Can’t Wait to be King…(4.3)-Why does Malcolm think he doesn’t have kingly qualities? What inspires him to change his mind? Do the characters in this scene think Macbeth has kingly qualities? What do you think it takes to be a good leader? Would you want to be king?
- What Makes a Man? (4.3)-Discuss the instances that manhood is addressed in this scene. How is “manliness” a motivator in previous scenes. Based on your discovery compare and contrast the values of being a man in Macbeth to manhood in modern times.
Please see the discussion board rubric linked below.
Riley Edwards 1st period No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteMacbeth is explicitly informed of his downfall. However, in his arrogance, he is still assured of his invincibility despite the fact that his doom is foretold. He believes that every man must be woman born and that trees cannot move, and while that may be true in our world, he lives in a world where there are prophetic witches. Magic happens. Even ignoring the possibility of magic, perhaps if individuals masquerade as trees and advance, they can emulate the image of a moving forest. If a person is born to a particularly young girl, he is girl born, not woman born. Macbeth is demonstrating his arrogance and ignorance in equal effect, which are both a result of his immense hubris. At this point, his eventual defeat is imminent, and he is powerless to stop it.
Leslie Castro (2nd).
DeleteI agree that Macbeth's ignorance and hubris really comes into play here. Just because the words, "woman born" seemingly have a surface-level value, it doesn't mean it can't mean anything. Macbeth refusing to look further into the prophecy will probably get him into trouble later on.
Brennan Lewis (6th)
DeleteI agree that Macbeth's determination to take things only at face value leads to his downfall. We see this characteristic beginning in the first act of the play, when Macbeth decides that, because of the witches' prophecy, he will become king and must murder Duncan. He has little thought for other possibilities without using violence.
Victoria Wiktor (2)
DeleteI completely agree that this brings out Macbeth's hubris because he is being so ignorant about what the witches had to say.
Kayla Curry PD. 2
DeleteI agree with this because Macbeth should know now that none of his littleplans are going to work.
I might add that it wasn't so much of eliminating the possibility of magic, so much as the greed and lust that has blinded him from seeing what is obviously in front of him after he became king. It is a common flaw in everyone who comes to power, perhaps they comprehend the ephemeral nature of their control and seek to ignore anything indicative of their inevitable collapse.
DeleteI love how you used "Magic happens" to justify your argument. Also, your use of vocabulary is phenomenal.
DeleteQuinton Champitto - I just can't wait to be king
ReplyDeleteMalcom does not believes that he is not capable of course breaking a country. Mostly he fear that the country may not respect him because he fled in fear of Macbeth. He decided to change his mind when he learns of the horrible deeds that Macbeth has committed as king, Macduff convinces him that whether or not Malcom is an ideal king he is the best choice and can be no worse than Mabeth.
I think to be a leader one must be capable of controlling, and commanding, but also be able to be friendly when needed. If a leader is hated than anarchy will soon follow in the leaders absence. I don't think I would make a good king, and do not feel capable of running a country.
Heavenlee Burt (6th)
DeleteI agree with you on that sentiment, a leader needs to be diverse in his roles to his kingdom. If a leader is too friendly then people will find them weak and try to rule over them but if a leader is too forceful then they will be called a tyrant like Macbeth.
Monica Ramirez (pd 6)
DeleteI think that being a ruler comes with a lot of responsibility and being too kind can be seen as a weak ruler. A ruler needs to be able to stay true to not only their country but themselves. Not letting their power get the best of them which can lead them to becoming a dictator.
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Delete(2nd Period)
DeleteI think you're right that a hated leader will not be a good leader. A leader should be friendly and empathetic, or else the people will resent him.
I completely agree with you. A king must be controlling and commanding to a certain extent or there will be anarchy like you pointed out.
DeleteI agree with you. To be king you have to do a lot of works.
DeleteI think Malcolm proves in this scene that he has what is necessary to be king. By understanding his own vices, and by extension their potential effects on his country and subjects, Malcolm is able to better serve as a leader. Additionally, he relies and uses the advice of Macduff, and it is critical of any good leader to listen to the expertise of those they trust.
Delete2 I think you're right that Malcolm is afraid of whether or not the people will respect him because of how he fled
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ReplyDeleteHeavenlee Burt (6th)
ReplyDeleteYou thoroughly enlightened me to many points about the apparition that I did not see previously. I did not think about the apparition being an image of Macbeth's marred soul that is tainted red.
Heavenlee Burt (6th) - No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteThe second prophecy lulls Macbeth into a strong sense of security as he seems to think himself to be invincible as the most common method in this time period was to be born from the womb and not be “untimely ripped”. The witches want to “draw him on to his confusion” by saying that “none of woman born shall harm him”, but Macbeth does not know of Macduff not being woman born yet ripped from his mother’s womb instead. This is his mistake and he falters because the first prophecy of Birnam Wood moving to Dunsinane has already happened. Macbeth knows that this last prophecy shall come true as all the rest did and he had already resigned himself to his unavoidable death when the woods moved. He knows this and he is satisfied knowing that he will die a noble death while fighting. When Macbeth lastly see’s the apparition he sees the taint that all these unspeakable deaths have caused upon his soul.
Austin Gain - 1st
DeleteI like the aspect that Macbeth is the type of tragic character that has the ability to be satisfied with his death. The fact that Macbeth will die a noble death gives Macbeth comfort, which usually is not a characteristic of a tragic character.
It is interesting to hear that the witches want to confuse Macbeth but also want to tell the truth. It is strange that witches wants Macbeth to feel more secure at first. I wonder if there is a goal to the witches except telling other people's faiths.
DeleteThe witches secure Macbeth's fate by informing him of it over and over. It's pretty ironic actually.
Deletelike the way u capture the significance of the witches second prophecy and how is made Macbeth feel like he's unstoppable, you mention that he was drawn to his confusion I totally agree
DeleteI think the significance of Macduff being ripped from his mother's womb keeps with the dark, unnerving tone of the play.
DeleteDeepak Badveli, No Man of Woman Born, 1st
ReplyDeleteAn apparition of a bloody child appears and tells Macbeth that “none of woman born shall harm Macbeth”. Everyone is born from a women generally so it does not literally mean someone born from their mother cannot kill Macbeth. It might mean the son or daughter of the woman who is not following her gender roles can harm him. The main effect that these apparitions have on Macbeth is a soothing and calming one. Being this comfortable to the situation can quickly get him overthrown and killed. Bloody child can be related to an assassin who manipulates the truth and deceives others. When targets least expect the child, he will murder them. I guess the bloody child is trying to indirectly convey the dangers Macbeth might be facing from his experience. The message spoken by this apparition is very cryptic and might explain why Macbeth believed differently on the situation. Another way of looking at this situation is that the apparitions know that Macbeth’s death is inevitable so they are trying to soothe him so he can enjoy the final moments of his life.
That thing about the gender roles makes sense. I remember something mentioned early on about how the witches didn't seem entirely masculine or feminine. I also remember Lady Macbeth wanting to strip away the things that kept her in the feminine mold at that time so she could kill the king.
DeleteI like how you pointed out that everyone is born from a woman
DeleteI like the details you added.
DeleteLeslie Castro 2nd Period I Just Can't Wait to Be King
ReplyDeleteMalcolm thinks he is unfit to be king because he is jealous and the country will have even more faults than it already does with him at the lead. He thinks his "black" sins will make Macbeth's seem "as pure as snow". Macbeth will look innocent, and Malcolm will seem terrible. His lust is worse the other's terrible deeds, because lust leads to terrible things. Malcolm honestly believes he does not have the traits of a just, virtuous king. Eventually he is persuaded by Macduff into thinking he would be a good candidate for king and would do anything for his country. In contrast the two think Macbeth is traitorous, false, and devilish.
I would not want to be king. I think people who aspire to be king are unhappy with the way their country is run and think they have greater reforms. I, of course, have my own changes I would like to be made in the country I live in. As a king I would get to have every kind of luxury I want... but at the expense of my freedom. I would have to watch every single action I made, every word I spoke, every step I took outside of my bedroom. The weight of my kingdom would rest on my shoulders and while it would be great to be in the ultimate leadership role, it is also the ultimate sacrifice. As King Henry IV says, "uneasy lies the head that wears the crown".
Brennan Lewis (6th)
DeleteI agree that being king, or achieving any kind of fame, leads to a loss of freedom. With great power comes great responsibility, and it sounds incredibly stressful. Someone is always unhappy with every government figure.
Monica Ramirez(6pd)
DeleteI also agree that with great power comes great responsibility. I would get annoy of the fact that in front of people i would not be able to be my own self, watching every step, word and action that i do would cause me to become very miserable.
I agree. I wouldn't want to be king either. I think when we are younger, we think it is this really "cool" thing to be, but in reality, it is impossible to keep everyone happy, which leads to a king's downfall in the end.
DeleteA certain confidence is required to make an effective leader. People are ignorant in many cases of the proper action to protect their own best interests, so any effective leader must understand the divide between other's wants and needs. Bridging that gap whilst maintaining an acceptable level of selflessness is a nigh impossible task.
DeleteI definitely agree with your perspective on becoming queen. When you mentioned ultimate sacrifice, it reminded me of Shakespeare's Sonnet 61 about a restless king. However, I do think you could make a great queen!
DeleteBettylenah Njaramba - Period 2
Leslie Castro (2nd period).
ReplyDeleteI agree that the second apparition is similar to Banquo's children that would have become king after Macbeth. It does symbolize his madness, since one of the reasons he killed Banquo is to make sure none of his children take Macbeth's crown away.
Brennan Lewis (6th) - What Makes A Man
ReplyDeleteIn Act IV, Scene 3, Malcolm attempts to convince Macduff that he is not fit to be king, making use of a variety of what he views as shortcomings of manhood. When he says, "Your wives, your daughters, your matrons, and your maids could not fill up the cistern of my lust..." (Lines 61-63), Malcolm is implying that as king, he would be unfaithful and run amok with the women of the court, detracting from his focus on making political decisions. This relates to the idea that the 'true man' must have self control and be virtuous in his decisions, and emphasizing the fact that lust is viewed as an 'evil' trait. Malcolm goes on to describe how he is greedy and otherwise immoral, and could not take the throne. Later in the scene, Ross informs Macduff that his wife and children have been murdered at the castle in Scotland, and Malcolm tells Macduff to "Dispute it like a man" (Line 220). In this way, Malcolm equates manhood to having the courage and honor to confront a murderer. He also is encouraging Macduff not to mourn for his family, because he doesn't view being emotional as a 'manly' trait. However, Macduff replies, "I shall do so; But I must also feel it as a man" (Lines 221-22), meaning that he must mourn the loss of his family and it is still characteristic of a man to do so.
In previous scenes, Lady Macbeth used stabs at Macbeth's manhood in order to persuade him to murder King Duncan. Masculinity is often first associated with violence, bravery, and sexual passion in character discussion throughout the play, and then developed to include emotional response and family ties. I feel that the stereotypical values of manhood today are almost identical to those in Macbeth, emphasizing using violence or physical strength to solve problems and turning most conflicts into contests of who is the most brave, tough, or noble. However, many norms of masculinity have changed in the 20th and 21st centuries, allowing much more space in society for feminine-presenting men and others who identify outside of the "most manly man" model. Many people still value honor, bravery, and chivalry, especially in regards to how men treat women. However, modern feminism movements have helped to expand the role that women play in the world and pave the way for expression of masculinity to change too.
I very much agree that feminism movements are helping shift the "men are strong, men are tough, men show no fear/sadness" stereotypes evident in Macbeth and in society today. I also like how you pointed out that Macduff will feel his loss as a man. I think Shakespeare was a few giant leaps ahead of his time (and even ahead of some of the ways of thinking in our time) by having a male character who recognizes that males are allowed to be sad, and to show that sadness to the world.
DeleteMeredyth Albright - Second Period
DeleteI love your note about modern feminism movements at the end here. I feel as though these prompts have been asking a lot about the traditional roles of masculinity, because that is a major part of Macbeth, especially regarding the relationship between Macbeth and Lady Macbeth, but it is refreshing to hear your point, because we have yet to discuss modern-day gender roles.
Monica Ramirez Period 6 I Just Can't Wait to be King
ReplyDeleteMalcolm doesn't think that he has what it takes to be king because hes does not see himself as a strong person. He knows that Macbeth is a strong king and fears that he won't be able to get the kingdom citizens attention since he did run away from Macbeth. Running away from Macbeth shows that he is scared and weak. Weakness is the number one thing that no one wants from their ruler. Malcolm because king because he is next in line for the throne. Thanks to Macduff who comforts Malcolm, he finally becomes aware of the fact that he can't be more worst than Macbeth. To be king one needs to be loyal to their country and people, brave,strong and stay true to their own roots. I don't think that i can be king because I struggle at time talking to a big crowd and i might let the power that comes with royalty go over my head. Fame does come with a price that at time could cause you to loose the ones close to you. Macbeth let his power get the best of him and little by little he is losing the ones that he love and were close to him.
I see what you mean there. Being in charge of a lot of people does kind of wear away at the face of the personality you once had. Macbeth had it even worse, as his own guilt was wearing him away on top of that.
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DeleteGordon Ma - 6th
DeleteI also said that a king needs to be loyal and brave, and I like how you said a king needs to "stay true to their own roots". Fame should be the last reason that a person would want to become a king - once it gets to your head, it's all over.
I liked how you said "I might let the power that comes with royalty go over my head." That's a good statement, at times that happens to people at times. They become an airhead or think they are better than others.
DeleteI agree with what you said. A king needs to be able to remain calm, and think for the betterment of his people. Macbeth does not have these traits, all he wants is power.
DeleteBrian Fischer (6th): I Just Can’t Wait to be King
ReplyDeleteMalcolm does not consider himself worthy to be king. He is afraid that he will be considered weak of cowardly for fleeing the country in fear of Macbeth’s reign of terror. He thinks that his own vices, such as jealousy, are so repulsive that they would make murderous Macbeth look like an angel. No character in this scene respects any qualities of Macbeth as a king. They think that Macbeth is a greedy and cruel murderer with no respect for the country. The two end up deciding that in the current situation, Malcolm wouldn’t be such a bad king after all.
Of course I want to be king. Bow down to me. Get a load of all this royal style up in your face, rolling down the red carpet in solid gold shoes. I’ll even slay a couple of current kings if I that’s what I need to do to be sitting on that velvet-layered throne in my multi-million dollar mansion of a palace.
I think I let out a bit much of my inner Macbeth there. I actually have no interest in being king. I feel like the spice of life would be pretty dull and far away if I were at the center of everything.
(2nd Period)
DeleteYour response to whether or not you'd like to be king was amusing and also pretty accurate. If you become king, or the center of attention as you said, you start having to worry about a lot of things that will make life pretty boring and stressful.
I agree that Malcolm does not consider himself worthy enough to be king but it is better to become one to help prevent further losses from the kingdom. I agree being the center of everything can get pretty dull after a while. It is better to enjoy your life with your friends and family.
Deletepd 6
DeleteI think that Macduff's unwillingness to be king, based on his awareness of his faults, proves that he would be decent at it
pd 2
DeleteI think there's truth in your response to whether or not you'd like to be king. The title comes with respect and wealth (which we would enjoy) but also responsibility and loss of privacy (which we wouldn't like as much).
I agree to be king s person must have have strength, be brave and protect the people.
DeleteI agree that Malcolm admits that he is not the perfect fit to be King, however is it better for him to deny the opportunity to be King because he would do the job poorly, or should he step up to the plate and be King because the people need him?
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ReplyDeleteVickie Wang (2nd Period) - I Just Can’t Wait to be King
ReplyDeleteIn Act 4 Scene 3, when Macduff urges Malcolm to overthrow Macbeth and take his rightful place as King of Scotland, Malcolm refuses. He says that under his rule, Scotland will suffer even more than it is now under Macbeth's rule. "When [my vices] shall be opened, black Macbeth / Will seem as pure as snow (4.3.63-64)," he tells Macduff, and goes on to describe in detail how sinful he is and how he has no virtues to counter it.
Although he ostensibly takes back his words once Macduff has passed the test of loyalty, there is some measure of truth in Malcolm's claims of not believing himself fit to govern. He is clearly insecure about taking the throne; otherwise, he would have asserted his right to be King once his father was murdered. However, he has heard about how the people are suffering under Macbeth's rule and has changed his mind, deciding to overthrow Macbeth. Both Macduff and Malcolm agree that Macbeth does not have kingly qualities. Instead, he is a tyrant undeserving of the crown.
Being a good leader is about balance. A good leader is ambitious, yet empathetic. A good leader needs to command authority, but he also needs to listen to the concerns of his people, because a leader is nothing without his people. A good leader doesn't order others around while he himself enjoys comfort; instead, he works alongside his people and leads by example. A good leader cares for and protects his people, but also pushes them to do their best and achieve the common goal. Above all, a good leader must always put the good of his team, community, or country above his own desires.
I would not want to be King because I don't think I could handle the responsibility. A leader must shoulder the burdens of others in addition to his own. He will have to make decisions for the good of the team, community, or country, but these decisions may not always appear to be in the best interest of an individual member. Those individual members may feel resentful and it is the leader's job to convince them otherwise. Also, being a leader is very taxing: the leader might often second-guess himself, especially if a decision he makes turns out to be a bad choice or simply results in harm to people he cares about, even if it's good in the long run.
Austin Gain - 1st
DeleteI agree that a good leader is all about balance. If a leader is too powerful, then the nation or whoever is being led will surely fall. However, if a leader is too weak, then the nation or whoever is being led will suffer the same fate. Moderation and balance are the keys.
I agree that a leader should "[work] alongside his people and [lead] by example." If a leader can't be representative of the ideal citizen of his/her nation, then what right have they to lead? This is why I think that leaders shouldn't strictly be from a certain lineage, such as they are in Macbeth. It is important to have leaders who understand the everyday citizen of their country, instead of having been sheltered in a cushy castle their entire life.
DeleteGordon Ma - 6th
DeleteThis is exactly why I don't believe in strict lineage, as Amanda said. A king should be selected by whom is most fit to lead, and nothing else. Lineage should have nothing to do with it. Of course, this would only happen in an ideal world.
I think it depends on the culture. Yes, i agree that a king should be selected by the best fit to lead, but in our culture, we take for granted the right to vote. We assume that everyone wants that right. When in actuality there are many cultures where people do not want the right to vote and could not imagine making a decision like that. They would rather lineage or someone else make the decision for them. So an "ideal world" is really in the eyes of the beholder, not so much our way.
DeleteAustin Gain - 1st - No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteIn Act IV, Scene I, three apparitions appear before Macbeth. The second of the three apparitions appears in the form of a bloody child and tells Macbeth that, "no man of woman born shall harm Macbeth." This prophecy gives Macbeth a sort of false confidence and comfort, even though the first apparition warns Macbeth to beware of Macduff. The bloody child form that the apparition appears in resembles the child being born from a mother the traditional way, instead of alternate methods, which makes Macbeth think that no man, not even Macduff, can kill Macbeth. This false confidence that Macbeth acquires will most likely be the beginning of Macbeth's downfall as a tragic character. This prophecy by the second apparition will most likely come back later in the play and will ultimately cause Macbeth's defeat.
I agree that Macbeth's downfall will come because of his failure to carefully consider possible weaknesses. The tragic hero has gained quite a bit too much confidence.
DeleteConfidence, in reality, is necessary to achieve most anything, and while that trait can proceed to its negative cousin, arrogance, having confidence in and of itself is a requisite for success. When Macbeth goes from being merely confident to clearly arrogant, as he does upon hearing the prophecy, his defeat is assured.
DeleteAmanda Nemecek (6) – No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteThe second apparition appears to Macbeth with a bang, literally, as the stage directions for its entrance are as follows: “Thunder. Second Apparition, a Bloody Child.” (Act IV, Scene I) Of course the apparition’s message is important, as it gives Macbeth a false sense of security by stating that “None of woman born shall harm Macbeth.” (Act IV, Scene I) Yet the apparition’s appearance is just as important. The fact that the apparition is a) bloody and b) a child could stem from multiple lines of reason. One reason for the apparition being blood-soaked is that it urges Macbeth to “be bloody, bold, and resolute.” (Act IV, Scene I) Another reason could be that this apparition represents all the blood that Macbeth already has on his hands and signifies the blood yet to come. This line of thinking also plays into the fact that the apparition appears as a child.
When the apparitions appear to Macbeth, it is at the behest of the witches, who have conjured them so that the king may know his future. They all offer him pieces of prophecy that point to him being safe from Macduff. Still, after receiving the second set of prophecies Macbeth cannot rest easy. He thus commands another murder, this one of Macduff’s family. Macduff’s young son is included in this slaughter, crying out “He has killed me, mother.” (Act IV, Scene III) The second apparition being a bloody child is foreshadowing this senseless murder of innocents.
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Deletepd 6,
DeleteI like the idea that the bloody child is related to Macduff's son. It provides obvious foreshadowing.
Amanda Nemecek (6) – No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteThe second apparition appears to Macbeth with a bang, literally, as the stage directions for its entrance are as follows: “Thunder. Second Apparition, a Bloody Child.” (Act IV, Scene I) Of course the apparition’s message is important, as it gives Macbeth a false sense of security by stating that “None of woman born shall harm Macbeth.” (Act IV, Scene I) Yet the apparition’s appearance is just as important. The fact that the apparition is a) bloody and b) a child could stem from multiple lines of reason. One reason for the apparition being blood-soaked is that it urges Macbeth to “be bloody, bold, and resolute.” (Act IV, Scene I) Another reason could be that this apparition represents all the blood that Macbeth already has on his hands and signifies the blood yet to come. This line of thinking also plays into the fact that the apparition appears as a child.
When the apparitions appear to Macbeth, it is at the behest of the witches, who have conjured them so that the king may know his future. They all offer him pieces of prophecy that point to him being safe from Macduff. Still, after receiving the second set of prophecies Macbeth cannot rest easy. He thus commands another murder, this one of Macduff’s family. Macduff’s young son is included in this slaughter, crying out “He has killed me, mother.” (Act IV, Scene III) The second apparition being a bloody child is foreshadowing this senseless murder of innocents.
I agree that the apparition being a bloody child is foreshadowing and also symbolism. The bloody child symbolizes the death of Macduff's son.
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ReplyDeleteHannah Medford, pd 6, No Man of Woman Born.
ReplyDeleteMacbeth starts to fear for his power at the beginning of this act and to make sure that it's secure he calls on the three witches. They present him with three apparitions the second of which is a bloody child who says that "none of woman born shall harm Macbeth" (line 91). We've already observed that prophecies can have many meanings and many ways to fulfill them, so this statement really only lulls Macbeth into a false sense of security. His eagerness for power cause him to overlook something that could have many loopholes. The fact that this comes from a bloody child should not inspire comfort. It tells him to be "bloody, bold, and resolute" (line 90) which creates violent imagery that foreshadows a disturbing future for Macbeth.
I completely agree when you say that he is lulled in a false security, almost as if he has false confidence. His false confidence is what blinds him into seeing the true reality of what is really going to happen and his downfall
DeleteI agree that Macbeth's ego and concerns about his power are what lead him to call on the three witches again. He's grown obsessed with the future of his power, and has to know if he still has it later. This obsession and his arrogance lead Macbeth into the false sense of security that you mention.
DeleteI agree with what you said that Macbeth was lead into false sense of security.
DeleteI agree with the things you wrote, that his confidence will blind him leading to his downfall. He has overlooked something that he probably would not have if he was in the correct state of mind.
Delete2 The second apparition definitely gives Macbeth a false sense of security and foreshadows his downfall.
DeleteSirisha Karra (1st) - No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteMacbeth IS informed of his downfall, something that was specifically stated, which he really does not realize. Three apparitions appear before Macbeth, one of them saying that "no man of woman born shall harm Macbeth". Here, Macbeth is given false hope in a sense, knowing that there will be something that cannot harm him, which deludes him into believing that he is safe and makes him feel more comfortable than he really should be. This "confidence" that Macbeth gets is what leads him to his major downfall - signaling his role as the tragic character through out the play. This prophecy is bound to come back later on to really cause his downfall, something that Macbeth will not see coming because of the false hope and confidence that he has developed. Although it is good that he is enjoying the time that he has left, his confidence is a delusion to his reality.
(1st period) I agree that Macbeth does become more confident after the second apparition. He has false hope that he will not be harmed although the apparitions are actually warning him of his fate.
DeleteElizabeth Vicario, pd. 2
DeleteMacbeth's extreme paranoia yet dangerous overconfidence make me think he's taking LSD or something- it's interesting to realize that this was a very believable play to watch in the time of Shakespeare. Any of those audience members at the Globe would have acted the same way if they were given these prophecies, but if it happened today we would have the witches put in an asylum.
Period 6
DeleteI think it's interesting that you used the world "deludes" in reference to the false hope the apparition gives him. By this point, Macbeth is just living in a state of delusion, whether it be the hallucinations he's having or the idea that killing off his enemies will solve all of this problems. Any notion this apparition gives him of hope that he will not die by man's hand is perhaps the biggest delusion of all. He's grasping at straws, in both his sense of survival and his sanity.
I think I agree about how he feels more confident about the false sense of hope. The fact that he rejects the idea of the trees rising to defeat him shows just how paranoid he has become, and how much his ambition has taken over his personality
DeleteRachel Matsumura (2) - No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteThe second apparition is shown as a bloody child. Macbeth’s lust for power (and his current “success”) has boosted his ego, emphasized by the statement: “laugh to scorn/the power of man” (Act IV Scene 1, 79-80). Macbeth’s belief that he is invincible- “Then live, Macduff. What need I fear of thee?” (82)- is contradicted by his next statement: “But yet I’ll make assurance double sure/and take a bond of fate. Thou shalt not live.” (83-84) He is still concerned that someone is going to take his power from him, which is why he returns to consult the witches: he must know his future so he can preemptively kill anyone who will get in his way. The vision serves as a reminder to the audience of Macbeth’s arrogance: “none of woman born/shall harm Macbeth.” (80-81) Perhaps woman refers to “lady,” as in a woman of higher class during these times. The future is open to interpretation, and Macbeth is very closed-minded.
Elizabeth Vicario, pd. 2
DeleteI can't help but wonder if Macbeth did think about the possibility of a double meaning in the witches' hints. To us it seems obvious that there is something more to the line than its literal meaning; the dramatically ironic scene is just painful to watch for those that realize that the witches must be giving him a false sense of security with this cryptic line.
Kadijah Holder (1st period) - No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteI took the significance of apparition number two in two different ways. The first was that of course, the apparition was saying, “Be bloody, bold, and resolute; laugh to scorn,” because Macbeth wasn’t taking the first apparition’s warning seriously. He doesn’t believe that he should be afraid of Macduff. However, what the apparition means of, “The power of man, no woman born,” is that since Macbeth has killed the wife and children of Macduff, Macduff has became enraged and now has the power to kill Macbeth. Macbeth hasn’t had any children which is referring to, “no woman born.” The second way that I interpreted the significance of apparition number two is that since Macduff was the son of King Duncan. However, his wife or queen was never mentioned throughout the entire play. Although, obviously Macduff was born of a woman, it doesn’t seem to me that there was a mother figure in his life and that he was solely raised by the King.
I liked how you had two different ways of looking at this quote.I also agree that Macduff does have the power now to kill Macbeth.
DeleteDylan Kruesi (Period 1) – I just can’t wait to be king
ReplyDeleteThere are two main reasons that Malcolm initially believes he isn’t fit to rule. First off, he doesn’t see himself being a strong enough leader and second, he believes the people won’t accept his rule because he fled the country after the death of his father, King Duncan. Malcolm probably never would’ve attempted to gain his rightful position as king if it wasn’t for the information received from Macduff. Upon learning that Macbeth is more like a tyrant rather than a king, Malcolm is convinced that his return would be gratefully accepted and there is no conceivable way for him to lead the country worse than Macbeth has in his absence. No one believes that Macbeth possesses any qualities of a good leader, nor do they think he is a rightful heir to the throne. In order to lead a country you have to be strong and not attempt to be too kind, but if you lack kindness entirely then you will be resented and lack the respect of your subjects. To be a king you must have the strength to make tough decisions, but with great responsibility comes immense pressure and at this point in my life I don’t believe I could lead a country. With that said, I believe I would be vastly greater than Macbeth.
you're right, I think we often underestimate the amount of pressure that leading a country has on an individual. I think respect,as you said, is the most important trait in order to be a leader. If no one respects you, than no one will take you seriously or listen to you.
DeleteI agree with both of you that respect is necessary for a good king or any type of leader. Macbeth was incredibly respected as a Thane and it's clear how his first downfall happens when he actually ascends the royal hierarchy.
DeleteGordon Ma (6th) – I Just Can’t Wait to be King…(4.3)
ReplyDeleteNot sure if I’m understanding this correctly, but Malcom never really “changes his mind” about anything. His self-proclaimed “faults” are simply a test to see whether Macduff is truly loyal to himself and Scottland. He begins with a disclaimer that he doesn’t trust Macduff completely “I am young, but something You may deserve of him through me, and wisdom…” and begins criticizing his own flaws to completely convince Macduff that Scottland is doomed and without a fit king to lead it. Malcom talks about his several flaws, including his ridiculous sexual desires and his greediness: “It is myself I mean, in whom I know All the particulars of vice so grafted That, when they shall be opened, black Macbeth Will seem as pure as snow…” Of course, like Vickie said, there may be some truth to what Malcom thinks about himself. He probably is a little bit insecure about taking the throne, but all in all he’s still better than the tyrant Macbeth. In fact, that’s one thing that everyone can agree on – it doesn’t really matter who rules Scottland, as long as it’s not Macbeth. The characters in this scene do NOT think Macbeth has any kingly qualities.
Humility, loyalty and honesty are a few traits which a good leader must have. A good leader should exist to serve his people, and not the other way around. Of course, no one is perfect – every leader will have his or her own flaws. What’s important is his/her ability to recognize those flaws, and even in the most extreme of situations, not let them get in the way of the job at hand (ex: a leader can be greedy, but not at the expense of his followers).
If there already exists a king, and he seems competent and fulfills the three traits which I just outlined, then I would have no qualms with being his follower. I would not want to be a king because of the immense responsibility that I’d have to uphold to my people and my nation, though this is not to say that I couldn’t do the job well.
Gordon you are the king of Enloe. Anyway, I agree in your thought that Malcom is somewhat insecure, as he is probably afraid of the man who killed his father, even though he wants to get revenge. In a way he might be trying to say bad things about himself because he wants someone else to do the work for him, or he doesn't want to be put in a position where he is at risk from other people's desires.
DeleteI agree with your contentions for a leader, and how they are exhibited throughout the story. A king must certainly realize any flaws he has, that will only make him stronger. I also agree with your point that Malcom is insecure in taking the throne.
DeleteElizabeth Vicario, pd. 2- What Makes A Man?
ReplyDeleteThroughout the play, Lady Macbeth has reminded her husband of his unmanliness and cowardice, using his feelings to persuade him to do things even after the murders have been committed. In Act 3, when Macbeth freezes as he sees the apparition of Banquo seated in his chair, Lady Macbeth fixes the situation by insulting his manliness in front of the guests at dinner. She covers for the whole situation and claims that he has an illness (3.4.83).
Similar to the idea of King Duncan's murder making Macbeth a man, Malcolm comes to believe in aggression and hostility marking him as a man. Macduff shows him this by pointing out the vicious and brutal reign of Macbeth, who has now gone quite mad with power, doing harm for no apparent reason. When Malcolm tries to persuade Macduff to exhibit anger like a man, he replies: "I shall do so, but I must also feel it as a man” (4.3.222–223). Macduff teaches Malcolm that he is allowed to feel pain without losing his manhood, and that not every challenge must be conquered with strength. Personally, I find this to be the mark of adulthood, and I'm sure others would agree. Men and women that resort to anger to fight battles are no more mature than children, who do the same thing. Rational approaches to debate and argument display maturity and the wisdom that comes with age and experience.
I completely agree with you finding that Malcolm has reached the mark on manhood when he realizes that it is okay to have a defeat once and a while and to handle it with dignity.
DeleteI agree that Macduff has a slightly different view on masculinity than the norm for the time, but he also later says that instead of crying like a woman, he will take revenge on Macbeth. This shows that he still turns his grief into anger, like Malcolm wanted him to, but Macduff shows that he is more mature than Malcolm when he acknowledges that he has and feels emotions other than anger over his wife and children's deaths.
DeleteHelen Foyle—Period 6—No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteA child, the most innocent of beings, covered in blood is the embodiment of a contradiction. While one would expect the child to speak of the harm that will come to Macbeth, as the voice of such innocence should condemn such evil, the child does the opposite. The child states, “Be bloody, bold, and resolute. Laugh to scorn / The power of man…” (4.1.79-80) It is as though the blood that covers the child has corrupted the child’s purity. In many ways the child is symbolic of Macbeth, or Macbeth’s virtue. He began as one of righteousness and loyalty, but now, with blood-stained hands and conscience, he has become evil. The child is reflective of what Macbeth is telling himself internally, that “none of woman born / Shall harm Macbeth.” (4.1.80-81) Macbeth longs to believe that his position of power is stable and his mortality untouchable. This apparition is his false hope, this sort of childlike naiveté that wants to believe everything will be okay.
I hadn't thought about it this way, and hearing your take on it, I agree. I also think it's really interesting and shows negative character development that Macbeth refuses to look any further than he does - he's not as skeptical as he was originally, and is looking only for reassurance.
DeleteErin Eichenberger, p6- I was immediatly reminded of Lady Macbeth's line saying that she would kill her own child if necessary. I think that works with your idea of the child as Macbeth's virtue, something that Lady Macbeth (and eventually Macbeth himself) were happy to sacrifice.
DeleteJustin Magin (1st pd) – No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteThe significance of the second apparition from the witches is the true extent of Macbeth’s hubris. Even after he is warned of his downfall, he completely disregards the witches’ prophecies. He does not believe that the prophecies could actually occur, which we believe as well since trees cannot move and everyone is born from a woman. Of course Shakespeare proves us wrong, which is not too surprising considering there are three witches that can tell the future. Of course the moving forest could be an army of men disguised in camouflage, as to appear as a moving forest. A man born from a young girl also proves, technically, not to be born from a “woman.” It is obvious that Macbeth has become oblivious to his demise due to his exorbitant amount of hubris. As the audience knows now that his downfall awaits, we see the true character of our tragic hero, Macbeth. It is evident that his ignorance will be the ultimate cause to his death.
Period 6
ReplyDeleteThe feeling of "assured success" and invincibility you mentioned has parallels to Lady Macbeth's persuasive techniques (in the plot to kill Duncan). As Macbeth easily falls prey to both of these instances of reassurance, they serve to depict him as ungrounded and weak, which supports your statement about Macbeth allowing his hubris get the best of him.
Kaylin Cooley 2nd- I Just Can't Wait to be King...
ReplyDeleteMalcolm doesn’t think he has kingly characteristics because he claims to be lustful, greedy, and violent. He cries out to Macduff about how poor his qualities of a king are. He really fools him to test to determine whether Macduff is trustworthy or not. Macduff cries out “O Scotland, Scotland!” and "thy hope ends here.” Malcolm realizes that Macduff’s loyalty to Scotland is true. He then says “Psych!” Meaning what he said wasn’t true. Kingly qualities would include justice, verity, temperance, stableness, bounty, perseverance, mercy, lowliness, devotion, patience, courage, and fortitude. Allowing oneself to be sensitive and to feel grief is also necessary. Not only is Malcolm greedy, he might have every one of those great, kingly qualities. I wouldn’t want to be king, it comes with too much responsibilities. I, myself, do not have a lot of patience. Also, you have to be demanding at times and that just doesn’t fit my personality.
Morgan Coyle (2nd)- I also would not desire to be king. I agree that it is too big a burden to bear, and I don't really understand the desire to take the throne. Being king seems to be more stressful and dangerous than it's worth--it reminds me of the common desire to be rich, thinking that money will bring happiness, but when people actually get the money, they worry about keeping it and become so absorbed in it that they are making themselves miserable without realizing it.
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ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteIn the story we will see Macduff trying to convince Malcolm to be king, but Malcolm does not think that he has the qualities to be a good king. He feels like he's not strong enough, and Macbeth is a way stronger ruler the he is; therefore he thinks that if he try to overthrow Macbeth he will be looked as as the black sin and Macbeth will be the good one in the eyes of the people. But Macduff made him understand because Macbeth has the qualities to be the ideal king does not make him a great king which lead him to reveal all the evil things that Macbeth had done to the country and the people which lead him to change his mind on being the king.
ReplyDeletePersonally I think to be a good king one will have to be brave, loyal, strong, and honest to himself and his people, and a great leader will have show empathy when it's needed. I will never want or think about being a King/Queen because it takes a lot of work, also only certain people can full a seat of a King/Queen because being surrounded with power and having total control of everything can consume us. like Macbeth have shown us that power and greed can get the best of us.
Hannah Cooper(1)
DeleteI agree with the qualities that you listed in order for someone to be a good king. You make a great point that only certain people are able to handle the power of being a leader. Power can definitely turn into evil if placed in the wrong hands.
Victoria Wiktor (2) - I Just Can't Wait to be King...
ReplyDeleteIn the beginning of Act 4 scene 1, Malcolm is being really immature about the whole situation and wants to weep about Macbeth becoming King rather than standing up to him. He thinks he is unfit to rule a country because he believes that his country will call him a coward for fleeing and will not take him seriously once he returns. Malcolm goes on and on to Macduff about his flaws claiming that he is full of lust and and extremely greedy. He would take everyone's land and states that he does not have a good side to him. He then states that all of the good qualities a king should possess include: ustice, verity, temperance, stableness, bounty, perseverance, mercy, and many others.
None of the characters in this scene believe that Macbeth is set to be a good ruler. Both Malcolm and Macduff think that he is a tyrant rather than a king and that it hurts to even speak his name. The country is falling apart due to Macbeth and there is no one who is brave enough to stand up to him unless Malcolm gathers an army. Even though Malcolm thinks so poorly of himself, Macduff is able to counter all the negativity and say things such as you couldn't even find a devil worse than Macbeth.
I really enjoyed reading all of your points. I think the contrast between Macbeth and Macduff is fascinating. One is so confident in himself that he will stop at nothing to be king while the other is not sure of his own abilities and at first isn't ready to kill for the throne.
DeleteHannah Cooper(1)- No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteIn act four scene one of Macbeth, three apparitions appear to Macbeth. The second apparition looks like a bloody child. The bloody child says to Macbeth "Be bloody, bold, and resolute." This statement gives Macbeth confidence to keep his guard up and stay strong. The infant then says " Laugh to scorn The power of man, for none of woman born shall harm Macbeth." This causes Macbeth to feel relief because the first apparition told him that he should be afraid of Macduff. Macbeth feels that his power is safe because no one that has been born from a woman can harm him.
I believe that the second apparition symbolizes the destruction of Macbeth himself. A newborn infant symbolizes beauty and cleanliness because it has just entered the world and has not yet been corrupted by its surroundings. However, the infant that approaches Macbeth is covered in blood as if it has already turned evil. In the beginning of the play I think the character of Macbeth was similar to a newborn infant that was still clean and innocent. He had good relationships with the people surrounding him and clean conscience. However, after he heard the witches prophecy, he began to slowly morph into the bloody infant as he continued to commit crimes and lose pieces of his character.
Kayla Curry period 2
DeleteI agree with this statement.
Keara Klinge - 1st period
DeleteI like the simile of the clean newborn infant and the bloody infant. It's a good way of looking at this scene and it ties in pre-existing traditional symbolism (baby=pure) as well.
Kayla Curry No Man of Woman Born 4.1 period 2
ReplyDeleteThe significance of the second apparition of the bloody child is that is that this apparition said, “Be bloody, bold and resolute. Laugh to scorn the power of man, for none of woman born shall harm Macbeth." This bloody child just said, you do not have to fear anyone because you are the most high and nothing shall come of harm to you. This gives Macbeth confidence and now he thinks that he is indestructible when of course he is not. Now Macbeth is not scared of anyone and thinks he can do whatever he wants to achieve his goals which are ridiculous. This will be Macbeth’s downfall. He will not get away with what he is doing because it is not just. Macbeth does not need to listen to these apparitions; they are just giving him false hope. Macbeth does not know what he is getting himself into. He will see this in later acts.
Hannah Cooper(1)
DeleteI agree that Macbeth not being afraid of anyone will be his downfall. I think that at this point in the play Macbeth has completely lost control of his power. I think that Macbeth has started listening to every thing that he is told if he thinks it will help him get ahead, this is also a part of his downfall.
Morgan Coyle (2nd)-What Makes a Man?
ReplyDeleteIn this scene, manliness is associated with anger and repression of other more “feminine” emotions. Macduff decided that the best and manliest course of action is to turn his grief into rage and take revenge on Macbeth. Even with the progress western society has seen in gender equality since Shakespeare, anger is deemed the most acceptable emotion for a male to show. While sadness, grief, and fear are considered weak and therefore feminine, anger is the socially acceptable outlet through which men express their “weaker” emotions while still retaining their masculinity. Although redirection of negative emotions can be helpful and sometimes even feel cathartic, unnecessary anger is damaging to both the body and the psyche. Then, as well as now, the limited opportunity for socially approved expression of emotion was at the root of many problems, ranging from stomach ulcers to suicide. The fact that gender stereotypes and social pressures can cause and have caused both physical and mental problems shows how broken society is and how far we still have to go before femininity is not synonymous with weakness and men do not have to hide their emotions.
Keara Klinge - 1st period
DeleteI agree with what you said regarding how men express so many of their negative emotions through anger. I eagerly await the day this stops being a thing that happens.
I just want to say that I love this post and I agree with it 100%. I'd also just like to bring up how irritating it is that we talk about gender roles in class and how they aren't followed to a tee in the play because gender is fluid and people need to stop playing into the binary. Women can be angry, men can be sad. Everyone experiences emotion regardless of how they identify themselves.
DeleteErin Eichenberger, p6- The points you're making are really spot on. In the beginning of reading the play I was impressed with Shakespeare's ability to turn stereotypes on their head and have Lady Macbeth be a very "masculine" female character, with Macbeth being more "feminine." However, now I feel that he wasn't so much inverting the stereotypes as just emphasizing that masculinity is volatile and disaster-prone (as we see Macbeth become more "masculine," which is rather disappointing.
DeleteJohnny Huang (1st) - No man of woman born
ReplyDeleteIn his path to solidify his position as King, Macbeth visits the three witches in order to try and predict what will happen in the future. During this scene, Macbeth is explicitly told the dangers of anyone who is not “women born”. He takes this prophecy at face value, believing that everyone is women born, so that no one can hurt him. Not only this, but the apparition appears in the form of a bloody baby. His greed for power causes him to overlook an easily seen loophole, as he believes he has already won. This is his fatal flaw, his hubris. He even says, “Then live, Macduff. What need I fear of thee?” But then contradicts himself when he says “But yet I’ll make assurance double sure, And take a bond of fate. Thou shalt not live”. His willingness to kill shows his transformation from the beginning of the book to this point.
I agree that this Macbeth's hubris. It is when his pride really shows through and we know he will truly do anything to secure being king.
DeleteKeara Klinge - 1st period - Just Can't Wait to be King
ReplyDeleteMalcolm says about himself,
"The king-becoming graces,
As justice, verity, temperance, stableness,
Bounty, perseverance, mercy, lowliness,
Devotion, patience, courage, fortitude,
I have no relish of them but abound
In the division of each several crime,
Acting it many ways."
He believes that kings must have at least some of these traits, but claims that he himself has none. He also admits to being incredibly lustful and greedy. both of which would hinder any chance of him being a decent king. However, once Macduff laments the degradation of Scotland thanks to Macbeth, Malcolm immediately takes back everything he had said: "I put myself to thy direction and unspeak mine own detraction, here abjure the taints and blames I laid upon myself, for strangers to my nature." Not only does he tell Macduff that they were all lies, he also says that they were the first lies he had ever told in his life: "My first false speaking was this upon myself." I think neither the first nor the second depiction of himself is completely accurate, because both are over-the-top exaggerations of a very evil and a very good person.
Both Malcolm and Macduff agree that Macbeth is awful and that practically anybody else would be better than him. Personally I believe that out of the qualities Malcolm listed, the most important ones in leadership are patience, mercy, and perseverance. I say these things because an impatient and hot-headed king will make nobody happy and will only cause destruction in his country. I would not want to be king (or president or any other type of leader) because I would probably get angry and distracted too easily due to the large levels of stress.
I agree about the descriptions being over the top. I'm surprised his brother didn't see through them. The characterizations of good and evil are interesting because all the characters in the play are a mix.
DeleteWalker Morrell 1st Period- No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteAct 4 Scene 1 begins with Hecate, the leader of the witches, meeting with the other witches to concoct a method of action towards Macbeth. The witches have already seen how their first prophecies affected Macbeth and now they are going to take their power even further to feed Macbeth's fatal flaw of overconfidence. Before they meet with him, Hecate says, "Oh, well done! I commend your pains, And every one shall share i' th' gains," (4.1.39-41). The witches have been working and now it is time to enjoy meddling with Macbeth. The second apparition is a form a juxtaposition as it is meant to be frightening as well as comforting. A bloody child appears, repetitively screaming Macbeth's name. However, it offers him reassurance in his safety, saying, "Be bloody, bold, and resolute. Laugh to scorn the power of man, for none of woman born Shall harm Macbeth," (4.1.79-81). This is meant to give the tragic hero some false comfort and lead him further down the path to his ultimate tragic downfall.
I think it's interesting how you think the apparition is meant to deceive Macbeth which will ultimately lead to his destruction. I agree but I believe there will be some form of loophole so what the apparition said will still be true such as the man taking over the kingdom not being born from a woman.
DeleteI really admire in particular the fact that in addition to giving false comfort, the apparitions also provide foreshadowing for the audience, and allow the audience to see how Macbeth's character has developed to the point where he no longer thinks of anything but trusting these visions, where he was so hesitant before.
DeleteCatherine Lumsden (2nd) -No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteThe second apparition is of a bloody child. This could symbolize Macbeth's paranoia about the children of Banquo taking his thrown. It also shows how far Macbeth has come from the beginning, filled with doubt on whether to kill King Duncan or not, to plotting to kill the children of his former friend. The child could also be the remains of his conscience and morality as he looks for justification to murder once again.
After Macbeth sees the vision, he says "What need I fear of thee?" This shows that he feels that his position is secure. He dismisses the first prophecy about Banquo's sons in favor of feeling safe. The purpose of the three witches, to make Macbeth feel safe, is achieved. They tell him through the apparition to "laugh to scorn the power of man" because none can touch him.
Alex Miller 2nd Period I Just Can’t Wait to be King
ReplyDeleteMalcolm doesn't think he would make a good king due to his overwhelming lust and greed. He also doesn't believe he has the qualities suited for a King such as justice, truth, moderation, stability, generosity, perseverance, mercy, humility, devotion, patience, courage, and bravery. "But I have none. The king-becoming graces,As justice, verity, temperance, stableness, Bounty, perseverance, mercy, lowliness,Devotion, patience, courage, fortitude, I have no relish of them but abound In the division of each several crime, Acting it many ways. Nay, had I power, I should Pour the sweet milk of concord into hell, Uproar the universal peace, confound All unity on earth." Malcolm initially believes that if he were to become King the world would go to hell. Macduff helped Malcolm to "change his mind" by just telling him that any heir to the throne is cursed. Malcom then did a complete 180 and said that he would be perfectly suited to be King. Both Malcolm and Macduff agree that Macbeth should not be King. "I grant him bloody, Luxurious, avaricious, false, deceitful,Sudden, malicious, smacking of every sin
That has a name."
I think a good leader must be intelligent, accommodating but not weak and have the people's interests in mind when making decisions. I think I would make a horrible queen unless somebody else told me exactly what to do because I'm extremely headstrong and I take offense when people don't agree with me. I'm always right and will never admit that I'm wrong even when I am. I would also probably make laws that everyone would hate such as every family must adopt a baby before they have one themselves (in order to decrease overpopulation and world poverty) and I would ban hunting and the meat industry.
No Man of Woman Born - Louis Jacobowitz (pd. 1)
ReplyDeleteAll of the apparitions in scene one point to Macbeth's downfall. The first warns him of Macduff, explicitly, and sets up an important plot point that will lead to dramatic irony with the second apparition. The second apparition states that Macbeth cannot be harmed by any man born of a woman, and though Macbeth does not connect the dots, the medium and principles of fiction immediately lead the audience to connect Macduff to this description. Ergo, Macduff must not be of woman born. Is he, then, a demon or witch in disguise? Or was he conceived of a woman but born by caesarean section, which might not count as being woman born? Either way, the audience, by making this connection, is made to realize that Macduff is different than Macbeth in some way, and that Macduff will be the one to kill Macbeth at the end of the play. It also calls into question Macduff's symbolic humanity - by painting Macduff as different than Macbeth, the scene also implies that Macduff symbolizes other, positive aspects of humanity that make him into a foil of Macbeth - nobility and honor. In these few lines, Shakespeare manages to redefine the audience's perceptions of one who has up to now been a relatively minor character.
The bloody child, it could be argued, which the second apparition appears as, might also foreshadow Macduff's nature - innocence and righteousness, splattered upon by Macbeth's sin. It also points to Macduff having been born somehow, in some more dirty way than regular birth.
Katherine Concepcion, Pd. 2 - No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteThe second apparition is a bloody child that lets Macbeth feel secure because of the witches' prophecy that “no man of woman born shall harm Macbeth” (Act IV, Scene I). Despite the warnings of his downfall, Macbeth ignores the witches’ prophecies. His cockiness and greed for power made him believe that every person is women born, which causes his false sense of security (What need I fear of thee?) He fails to think about the other methods of child birth, so he believes that he will not fail. Macbeth’s false sense of security was his mistake because now he feels more comfortable than he should be, which will ultimately lead to his downfall. Macbeth plans another murder, which is where he continues to lose his sense of character and turns into the bloody child that he faced before.
I love the idea of Macbeth being trapped in a naive childlike state. It almost seems as though Lady Macbeth has taken on a warped, motherlike authority in regards to Macbeth.
ReplyDeleteKaitlin Coleman, pd. 6
ReplyDeleteNo Man of Woman Born
There are many ways in which apparition number two can be interpreted, but the most obvious seems to be the fact that the witches initial prophecy that "no man of woman born" would be able to harm him. As I read in a classmate's review of the play, it could be symbolic of Macduff being ripped from his mother's womb; which creates a dark and unnerving picture that lends itself to the eerie mood of the play. Another interpretation could be a premonition in regards to the slain Banquo's unborn and bloody sons who were destined to take over Macbeth's crown. Either interpretation of the hallucination furthers the idea that Macbeth's guilt is slowly taking over his psyche and will eventually lead to his downfall.
Justn Ledinh- Pd. 6- No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteAs seen in Act 4, Scene 1, the witches call upon three apparitions to please Macbeth's desires to learn of the future. The first apparition is a armored helmet that warns Macbeth of Macduff's plans to overthrow Macbeth. The second is a bloodied child whom tells Macbeth that "The power of man, for none of woman born, shall harm Macbeth." Finally, the third apparition is of a child with a crown and tree in hand who tells Macbeth that he will not be defeated until "Great Birnam Wood to high Dunsinane Hill shall come against him", or until the land moves and fights him. Speaking of the second apparition in particular, I believe that the second apparition may represent Macbeth's missing child that he cannot bear, and how Macbeth will never have a legacy. I think Macbeth takes what it says the wrong way, and because of his arrogance, he believes that there will be no one who can kill him because the apparition says that no one born from a woman can kill Macbeth. Immediately we see that Macbeth's arrogance leads him astray, as he no longer feels threatened by Macduff, as he says "Then live, Macduff. What need I fear of thee?"
nice job, justin. i think it's clear that these phantoms foreshadow his future misfortune. looks like his ambition has really brought his downfall upon him
Deletei agree- his misfortune is definitely shown. His hubris leads to his downfall.
DeleteI agree, as right after the second apparition, Macbeth no longer feels the need to kill Macduff. Macbeth's arrogance is so strong that he takes everything the apparitions say just on the surface and doesn't actually look at what they are trying to tell him.
ReplyDeleteErin Eichenberger, p6- What Makes a Man?
ReplyDeleteThe first mention of manliness in Act IV Scene III occurs when Macduff encourages Malcolm to take up arms to defend the motherland, “Hold fast the mortal sword, and like good men bestride our down-fall'n birthdom,” after Malcolm suggests they find a quiet place and cry for a while. By the end of the scene, however, it is Malcolm who demands that Macduff “Dispute [the murders] like a man” and Macduff who insists he first needs to feel it (also like a man.) Macduff goes on to say that he could cry like a woman, but there's fighting to do. Malcolm calls this very manly, and they head on their way.
Previously in Act II, Lady Macbeth weaponized Macbeth's own tender masculinity against himself, demanding that he shape up and stop worrying about the murders. In Act III, Macbeth takes a similar cue and taunts his hired murderers by asking if they “Have a station in the file, not i' the worst rank of manhood” (Act III, Scene I.)
It's no longer expected or acceptable for men to casually kill other people for revenge, so in that respect manliness has improved since Shakespeare's time. However the core beliefs in power, control and strength have not shifted significantly. Manliness is almost synonymous with strength, as femininity is related to delicacy. Manliness is different from what are identified as good qualities in men, however, and even in Shakespeare's time, some measure of sympathy is appreciated. It was expected that a good king would rule with mercy and kindness, traits that a good man (or any human today) should embody.
Diu Rahlan(p.6)- I Just Can’t Wait to be King
ReplyDeleteMalcolm does not think he has kingly qualities because he think he is "lustful", "greed", and "violent". Macduff start saying “O Scotland, Scotland!” and agree that Malcolm is not fit to be king. This made Malcolm trust Macduff. No, Malcolm and Macduff think Macbeth does not have the kingly qualities because Macbeth have killed many innocents people and do whatever he want. Macbeth is really violent and would kill people that got in his ways. I think to be a good leader you have to listen to the people, be kind and respect,brave and strength, and protect your people. I would not want to be king because I can't handle dealing with people and being king is a lot of work.
I agree that committing the killings that Macbeth king makes him an unsuitable king, but it was outside sources that convinced him to become such a bad person, so is this really his fault? His sorry state of mind forced him into this awkward corner.
DeleteElijah Bader(2nd)-What Makes a Man?
ReplyDeleteAct IV, Scene 3’s first comment regarding manhood is “Let us rather / Hold fast the mortal sword, and like good men / Bestride our down-fall'n birthdom….” Also, later when MacDuff is reacting with grief about finding out that his family has been murdered, Malcolm’s first comment is “Dispute it like a man.”
“Manliness” is used a motivator in a previous scene with Macbeth portrays stereotypical feminine traits like remorse or really just emotion in general around the time of his murder of Duncan. Lady Macbeth shows no sympathy and told him to act like a man. She did the same thing when he thought he saw Banquo sitting in his throne at the party.
This is how men are today. Soldiers are trained to not feel emotion after killing people, but our brains are naturally made to feel bad after killing our own species. This is so strong that many soldiers come home with PTSD. On the other hand, thanks to the feminist movement, there are more men trying to work on having a more emotional side.
Kevin Gao (2nd period)- Can't wait to be king
ReplyDeleteIn Act 4, Scene 3, Macduff is trying to convince Malcolm to go back to Scotland and overthrow Macbeth the tyrant, so as to regain his rightful place as the king. Malcolm doesn’t want to at first; he admits that he is lustful, greedy, and violent, and that these are not the qualities of a good king. Malcolm is also wary of Macduff for not being loyal to him, and he thinks that he might betray him to Macbeth. Malcolm says that he wouldn’t make a good king even if they could defeat Macbeth, and despite all the things that Macduff suggests to solve Malcolm’s vices, in the end he states that Scotland is pretty much doomed, which reaffirms Macduff’s loyalty to Malcolm.
What causes Malcolm to regain his confidence in himself as a good leader is when he hears about all the horrible things Macbeth has done, the most horrible of which is that Macbeth has killed Macduff’s family. Malcolm advises that Macduff turn his sadness into anger towards Macbeth, and he promises that he will return to Scotland with ten thousand soldiers to remove Macbeth from the throne.
I think that being a good leader should be someone who is trustworthy to lead others, someone who is enthusiastic about their work and confident in his or her actions. They must function in an orderly and purposeful manner. The leader should have good ideas, but should also listen to his subordinates for their contributions. Most importantly, a good leader is one that keeps the main focus on the goal, not only by viewing the situation as a whole, but also by managing his subordinates to carry out his ideas, all while carefully planning the steps for getting to the goal.
Based on my own understanding, I would not want to be King because there’s an enormous amount of responsibility involved. It is difficult to maintain your position all while trying to please everyone’s needs and solve your country’s problems to the best of your ability. It is dangerous to be king; there is always someone who wants your position and will stop at nothing to remove you from it.
Svetak Sundhar-pd.6- What makes a man?
ReplyDeleteLady Macbeth toys with Macbeth, using his feelings to persuade him to do things even after the murders have been committed. In Act 3, when Macbeth freezes Lady Macbeth fixes the situation by insulting his manliness in front of the others.
In this context, manliness is used as something that brings about specifically desired qualities. This is a very similar sense to which manliness is used today- it tries to motivate people to work harder. Boys are typically cultivated to be have stereotypical "manly" qualities, including strength.
Julio Derteano- No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteMacbeth is specifically told about his downfall, yet his ignorance gives him a false sense of invincibility. In Macbeth's thoughts there never will be a man born without a woman nor will there ever be trees that move. He seems to have fogetten that witches have told him about his future before and all had been correctly predicted, yet he refuses to believe them now. There may be many different possibilities of of these statements to be true. People may have disguised themselves to be trees and there is also a possibility that a girl could have had a child or even surgically removed. MacBeth is showing a huge amount of hubris, thus resulting his inevitable doom.
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ReplyDeleteJames Morton - 6th Period - What Makes a Man?
ReplyDeleteThis act really magnifies its outlook on pathos, exploiting a man's dignity by a woman controlling his mind. Lady Macbeth shows supreme control over Macbeth's actions, despite his thoughts against them. When Macbeth freezes up in front of the crowd due to his deteriorating mental state, he still cannot give up his manhood and allows Lady Macbeth to insult him to help control the crowd and please them.
To be a man is sort of a rite of passage back in Macbeth's time, and this mindset still lingers to this day in age as well. It motivates people to change drastically to "fit in" with other "men". Boys are almost obligated to show these traits of manliness just to not be insulted like Lady Macbeth does to her husband in this act. Mental deterioration doesn't help with this at all, after Macbeth's killings.
Brianna Bulgarino No Man of Woman Born 2
ReplyDeleteAct 4 opens with the three witches who are approached by Macbeth questioning the prophecy. To answer his questions, they call upon three apparitions. The second one is a bloody child that says, “Laugh to scorn the power of man, for none of woman born shall harm Macbeth”. This implies that no one can defeat Macbeth and steal the crown because everyone is born from woman. This apparition makes Macbeth too comfortable in the decisions he has made to become king and in his future decisions. I think this apparition also foreshadows Macbeth’s downfall. It shows that Macbeth will become more arrogant and continue to make bad decisions.
Kiya Cotton
ReplyDeletePeriod 6
No man of woman born
Macbeth's ignorance starts to show. This kind of shows in the beginning act of the play. The scene really brings out Macbeth's hubris. He does not want to take in full affect about the witches opinion. He is viewed as being the bloody child. This makes him feel secure. Macbeth is being naive about the prophecy. The witches want to confuse Macbeth but tell him the truth at the same time, to see what he will fall for. Macbeth was drawn in by the witches. This scene points out where Macbeth is at fault, and where he is going down. This scene also points out Macduff's birth, but in a different way. The best way that apparition can be explained is by the witches trying to hurt Macbeth by “ no man of woman born' prophecy.
You made me realize major points
ReplyDeleteSanjay Akkina(Period 2) - No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteIn Act 4, Scene 1, there are three apparitions which the witches reveal to Macbeth. The second apparition is a bloody child which tells Macbeth that "No man of woman born shall harm Macbeth". This gives Macbeth false confidence that he doesn't have to kill Macduff. But since the first apparition told Macbeth to beware Macduff, Macbeth states that he will Macduff just in case in order to conquer his own fear. Since Macbeth has become overconfident, he believes that he can accomplish anything. This foreshadows the downfall of Macbeth which we may later see in the future acts as a tragic character.
Angel Johnson (6) No Man or Woman Born
ReplyDeleteIn Act 4 Macbeth seeks out the 3 witches for more information. The witches summon apparitions who tell Macbeth his fate. The first coming from a floating head who warns him of Macduff, the second being a young bloody child who tells him “none of woman born shall harm Macbeth” and “Macbeth shall never vanquished be until Great Birnam Wood to high Dunsinane Hill Shall come against him”. Which makes Macbeth pretty invincible if you ask me, trees can’t move and everyone comes from a woman. But honestly at this point in the play after everything that has happened thus far, I’m sure there’s a loophole and Macbeth will inevitably die.
Bettylenah Njarmaba - Period 2 - No Man of Woman Born
ReplyDeleteI found this part of the play to be incredibly intriguing. Macbeth was, more or less, fully informed of his downfall by the witches. However, it wouldn't be much of a dramatic play if they just spoiled the ending like that! So of course, this information was shared to Macbeth in a way that his hubris would lead him to believe he was invincible. I would compare it to a riddle. He was told that no man of woman born could harm him, which could easily lead one to believe that no one could ever harm him. This scene foreshadows Macbeth's downfall and emphasizes the theme of "everything isn't as it seems."
Meredyth Albright – 2nd Period – What Makes a Man a Man?
ReplyDeleteThe values and gender norms of manhood run throughout the play. Lady Macbeth, though she protests the most about gender norms, is a major proponent for separate gender roles, although she would probably be a large advocate for gender equality, also known as feminism, in modern times. In the times of Macbeth, “manliness” was seen as being brave, valiant, and powerful. Lady Macbeth displays these traits, whereas Macbeth is timid, frightened, and eaten up by guilt. Therefore, they display Shakespearean role reversal. Throughout the play, Lady Macbeth motivates her husband by taunting him about not being manly, using his self-consciousness to drive his ambition to do her will. In Act Three Scene Four, starting with Line 83, Macbeth is petrified by the apparition of Banquo at the banquet, in front of all their esteemed guests. Lady Macbeth smoothes the awkward tension by claiming that Macbeth has a hallucinatory, long-term mental illness, insulting his manhood privately, in attempt to get Macbeth to behave in front of the guests.
Malcolm seems to think that by being violent and aggressive, he will be deemed a man. Macduff convinces him of this by reminding him of how much Macbeth has gained by being an unjust and violent King. He responds by saying “I shall do so, but I must also feel it as a man.” (Act 4 Scene 3 Lines 222-223) Malcolm learns from Macduff that manhood is not invincible; that Malcolm can experience pain and failure without being any less of a man; that masculinity can even be found in failure. This shows a more expansive version of the unforgiving, often brutal ideals of masculinity in Macbeth’s time. In current times, boys and men are taught not to cry. In fact, emotion is a sign of weakness, seen as feminine, or being a “sissy”. This makes me absolutely sick. If feelings and emotions are not natural, then why do we experience them? Even Jesus cried in the Bible, the night before he was crucified. If anyone exhibits the ultimate courage, it is Jesus, who was crucified for doing absolutely nothing wrong. Therefore, it is stupid to associate masculinity with the quenching of emotions. The phrase “man up” is inherently wrong. As Betty White puts it, “Why do people say ‘grow some balls’? Balls are weak and sensitive! If you really wanna get tough, grow a vagina! Those things take a pounding!”